The following is a transcript of an episode of From the Front Row: Student Voices in Public Health, the University of Iowa College of Public Health’s student podcast. This episode features a discussion between College of Public Health student Oge Chigbo and recent alumnus Ian Buchta, in Buchta’s final podcast. This episode was published on July 30, 2020.

Oge Chigbo:
Welcome back to From the Front Row, brought to you by The University of Iowa, College of Public Health. I’m Oge Chigbo.

Ian Buchta:
And I’m Ian Buchta. If this is your first time with us, welcome. We’re a student-run podcast that talks about major issues in public health and how they are relevant to anyone, both in and out of the field of public health.

Oge Chigbo:
All right. So today is a very special episode because this is actually Ian’s last episode with us. I know I’ve actually made some past mistakes, so I’m always like, “Oh, Ian is graduating, so it’s his last episode.” But for real, this is his last episode. So Ian has journeyed with you all for the last one and a half years. Since he just graduated, he’ll be departing us. Before he goes, he’s going to talk to us about what he has learned in public health communication and what’s next for him.

Ian Buchta:
Yup. This is it for me. They are finally pushing me out, but I am so, so, so excited to hand off the baton, just to a group of talented podcasters who are going to continue to tell stories about public health. And frankly, you’re going to be telling some different, and new, and better stories in public health. So I’m really excited. But before I gosh, we probably should just jump into this episode and you’ll hear me, gosh, even more on the back end.

Oge Chigbo:
So for my first question for you is what made you want to get into podcasting?

Ian Buchta:
It’s funny. I knew I wanted to do podcasting before I went to The University of Iowa. I had written a book at that point and I was working as a scientific educator, and I really just wanted to try different media and different ways to reach different people and create accessible methods for people to be able to hear about scientific education. So originally, I came up with this idea for a podcast called Ripples, which is about Marine Science and water, but that ended up not ever taking off because I came back to The University of Iowa and went to graduate school. And then I got super excited about public health my first semester, and after that it was like, “Well, why don’t we just start sharing public health to people through podcasting? And let’s take stories and push out public health knowledge through stories.”

Oge Chigbo:
All right. That’s so great. Thank you for that. What have you learned from this podcast and working as a scientific educator about communicating science to people?

Ian Buchta:
I think the thing that I’ve learned is it’s just so much harder than you think, and it doesn’t matter if you have the facts on your side, it doesn’t matter if you know the truth is with you. Because of the internet, everyone thinks the truth is with them. So I think the biggest thing that you have to take away is you have to communicate with people and relate to them and listen to them. Even if their ideas are crazy, you should still listen to the person, because when people feel listened to, they feel like they’re entering into a dialogue. And that way, when you start entering into the dialogue with people, that can really help push through some science into their mind, and that really helps, if you can, bit by bit, through relationships with people really help them come to realize that certain things are true.

Ian Buchta:
And I think the other thing that I learned is always reach out to really prominent people like Dr. Tara C. Smith or @etiology on Twitter. She’s got like 60,000 Twitter followers. She had less when she came on our pod. I’m not going to say whether or not that was because of us, probably wasn’t, but you know what?

Oge Chigbo:
I’ll take it.

Ian Buchta:
But she came on and she was kind of a reach because she was a big deal even before the pandemic started. And we brought her on for a first episode of the pandemic-related coverage and it was like, “Wow, look at how people are willing to collaborate.” And that was really cool. But before we go on, Oge, I want to turn this question on you, because you’ve been journeying with us on the pod for a while, and what have you learned as you’ve communicated science with us?

Oge Chigbo:
I would just like to say this isn’t about me, first of all, it’s about Ian. But honestly, I have learnt a lot, just different aspects of public health that I really wasn’t aware since I just even came into this field not too long ago. So I just always had those five major principles or aspects of public health that we event do our sectors or sub sectors, but then coming on and just hearing real life people talk about real life things that are happening right now, and I’m just like, “Wow, I can definitely relate.”

Oge Chigbo:
And what you also even talked about, communication. Being able to communicate to people in a way that they understand and in a way that they are willing to listen to what you have to say. I think that’s also really a big deal in what I’ve learned from all the guests we’ve had, there are different ways to talk about things. There are people who use stories that are way out of even public health to convey a message, or there are people who just drop facts, but then again, backing it up with their own opinions too to supplement the facts that they have. So I think that’s definitely something that I’ve learned, just how different people have different ways to talk about the same thing in a different way and also make it engaging at the same time. That’s just amazing to me.

Ian Buchta:
I think one of the things, and this is the biggest challenge that I faced as a communicator, is I’m a bit robotic. And the thing that I learned from you, Oge, was to really try to humanize things and really try to put more human spin on to things. And I think that that was one of the biggest successes that we had over the course of the spring, where really our listenership has increased immensely. I think one of the biggest things for that was adding that banter in, adding that human side of public health end, and I think that has really helped. And that was something I didn’t really understand. I thought podcasts were supposed to be these hoity-toity news casting. And I think adding in that human element and really focusing on the human experience in addition to the science, I think that was something I’m going to take away from this and to every podcast I ever work on.

Oge Chigbo:
You’re welcome. And I guess also, since we’re representing the university, there’s also that whole distinction of can I make you human? How lax can it be? But then again, public health, if you don’t make it seem like an everyday thing, which it is, people would just really feel excluded like, “Oh, this is so sciency, this is so so academia, and this is not my field.” But public health really is everyone’s field. We live in public health, we breathe public health.

Ian Buchta:
The discretion of what to keep in and what to toss to the side, because we understand, you as the listeners only have so much time. And so we really do try to keep things as concise as we can, but we want to not lose the joyful elements because we love what we do and we love public health. So we want to keep in how we relate to people, but also how much fun we’re having when we talk about it.

Oge Chigbo:
All right. So what was your favorite episode that you’ve done?

Ian Buchta:
So this one was a pretty easy one for me until I thought about it, of course. And then I was like, “Oh wait, I’ve done a couple of really good ones.” And I thought it was going to be the episode I recorded with Dr. Mona Hanna-Attisha the first semester. And that was a really good podcast, and I think that was one of my best. But my absolute favorite was sitting down with William Moore of the Ramsey County Public Health Department, I believe, in Missouri, who talked about how dads can get more involved and how involving dads in public health can yield higher breastfeeding rates, can yield better infant outcomes. And I just loved that episode, because I’m really interested in men’s health and basically how intervening on men and making better men can make a better society. And if you intervene on men, you actually get better health outcomes for everyone.

Ian Buchta:
And so that’s something I’ve been passionate about, and when I saw that project, I loved it and it was so cool. And the fact that we got the interview with William Moore was really cool, because he had just gotten a 40 under 40 from the de Beaumont Foundation at that time. And oh man, I just loved it. If you haven’t had a chance to listen to that one, that is really worth going back and listening to because he’s just really interesting, really insightful, has these crazy ideas and these really cool ideas like doula dad’s, club dad, where he’s getting men just to sit around in circles and just talk about… And they get excited about their children.

Ian Buchta:
I know I’m gushing. The one thing that really stuck with me from that episode was, one of his quotes is, men will say, “We’re pregnant,” And then society will be like, “No, no she’s pregnant, you’re just along for the ride.” He’s like, “But that’s harmful and that pushes people fathers to disinvest,” And that blew me away. I never had thought about that, and I love that episode.

Oge Chigbo:
The power of words. Once you segregate things, people act accordingly like, “Oh, that’s not my thing.” But wow. I don’t think I’ve actually listened to that episode. When did you do that one?

Ian Buchta:
We’ve released it once back in probably August. It may have released before you came to the college, definitely before you started on the pod. But then we re-released it a few months ago. Definitely check it out. He just blew me away. I happened to be on the pod, but that’s not why I like it. You could have put anyone just talking to this guy because he was brilliant.

Oge Chigbo:
All right. You guys, you had to hear first. Let’s go back to August of 2019 to find this special episode. It does sound really interesting, and I need to listen to it too.

Ian Buchta:
But before we move on, I want to hear your favorite episode that you’ve made, Oge, or that you’ve been on.

Oge Chigbo:
Okay. I can’t really choose one favorite since I’ve actually liked all of it and I don’t like choosing favorites. Well, I will say, because I know if I don’t say Ian is going to drag me on the podcast, but the one that we released, the conversation I had with my other colleagues when we were talking about Black Lives Matter just from our own perspective, and I guess why I really also enjoyed it was because I was really involved. Not only was I host, but I was also-

Ian Buchta:
You produced that episode.

Oge Chigbo:
Right. I produced it. That was my first episode I ever produced. It was just a lot. It was like my baby. I was in charge of that episode. Usually, I just let Ian do all the work and I come and talk, but that one, Ian was just like, “Oge, it’s all you.” And I was like, “Okay.” So I guess that’s like my baby podcast and I really enjoyed that one. And also the last one I had with Steve when we were talking about the whole ICE drama. This year has actually really been a lot. I will say 2020 has been ridiculous, but I think we’ll definitely come out stronger than we came in. So that is definitely an advantage or a strength this year.

Ian Buchta:
I was not going to drag you, I was definitely going to mention the episode, it’s entitled The Conversation, it’s from about a month ago, and it’s the first episode you produced. It was also one of the best episodes this show has ever seen. And the fact that I got to edit that, because you produced that episode, I just did some of the back editing stuff. And the fact that I got to work on that, I was proud of the fact that I got to be a part of it, because it was just an awesome episode.

Ian Buchta:
So again, there’s another one that if you haven’t heard it, go back and listen to it. The other one was the conversation with Dr. Tara C. Smith that you pressured me to really dive into COVID and that was another of my favorites. So anyway, a lot of really good episodes. If you haven’t had a chance to listen to those, just go back and check some of them out, especially the one with William Moore and the conversation that Oge put together.

Oge Chigbo:
Yes guys, do that, and at the end, we’ll tell you where you can find us, tell us what you think if you’re really moved too. All right. Okay. So what is one thing that you thought you knew, but later realized that you were wrong about?

Ian Buchta:
I’ve asked this question so many darn times and I’ve put this into the script so many times you’d think I’d have an answer. So I think the thing that I thought was when everything goes wrong, I thought everyone reacted negatively and would get down. And I’m realizing that that’s not true at all. I think there’s a lot of people who are not ready to give up the ship, and are ready to keep fighting, and keep fighting, and keep fighting, and keep hoping for a better world. And I think that’s probably one of the things I’ve come to realize recently. And it’s one of the best realizations that a lot of people can see climate change, they can see this pandemic and they say, “I’m not ready to give up on this, I am ready to keep fighting and try to make this world better, even if I don’t get to live to see it.” And I think that is something that I just didn’t really realize how tenacious some people’s hope really is.

Oge Chigbo:
All right. So what’s the next one? Because I’ve answered this question too. If you’d like to know my answer to this question, listen to one of the many podcasts that we’ve released.

Ian Buchta:
Oge’s answer to the question and probably a better version of my answer to this question can be found on our holiday special from 2019.

Oge Chigbo:
Period. All right. So which guest gave you the best answer to that question?

Ian Buchta:
I think my favorite answer was from a journalist, Hannah Harris Green, who I think was in 2019 as well, and she just answered subtitles, that there are subtitles on the TV and she didn’t try to do a really deep profound answer to this, which is awesome. I’m glad people take this question in really deep directions, but hers, the reason why it’s so memorable to me is she was just like, “Oh no.” Subtitles, they changed my life, because you can actually see the dialogue.

Oge Chigbo:
All right. So I know you’d want to ask me this question back, but I’m just going to flip it up and say something different. I think something that I would love to see in future for public health or for everyone, and has been coming up is making sign language universal. Everyone needs to learn sign language. Because I was thinking about it. I think living in a world where there’s this segregation, where the deaf cannot communicate to other people, I don’t understand what kind of world that is.

Oge Chigbo:
And it’s so normalized that we think, “Oh yeah, it’s just okay,” Because we’re in a privileged point of view and we don’t understand how frustrating it might be. And also in Nigeria, I rarely see any disabled person because we just don’t have any changes or anything. You don’t have ramps, you don’t barely have elevators, nothing. So we’ve already ostracized them from society. So I would definitely want to see all of us, maybe within the next 10 years, by like 2030, maybe the amount of people who know sign language would have increased maybe by 30% or something. I think that would be amazing.

Ian Buchta:
I think that in 50 years we will talk about our treatment of people with different abilities the same way that people talk about-

Oge Chigbo:
Racial.

Ian Buchta:
Maybe not to the same degree, but we will realize that we have not been… And frankly, I probably should have made a podcast on disability, and that’s maybe something that it should happen in the future. Because we just do not take care of people in our society who have different abilities. And especially, oh my gosh, if you want to talk about mental health issues, people have differing mental states, and we are doing nothing to take care of those people and it’s going to be looked back on as an embarrassment. I think we will all look back on it and shame.

Oge Chigbo:
And it’s very easy to silence people, you wouldn’t even know you’re silencing them until people start to speak up, and you’re like, I know I didn’t, but yes we did, and we all aided into this. We all aided [inaudible 00:18:19] in some way, shape, or form. But that’s definitely something I would love to see happen, a change. We have to start with ourselves, so I’m going to have to start learning how to sign. I’m going to go to the next question.

Ian Buchta:
All right.

Oge Chigbo:
What is one thing outside the world of public health that has interested you lately?

Ian Buchta:
So this is cheating because I’ve been playing it for 15 years, but very recently I have been just playing so much more Dungeons & Dragons because I can connect with my friends from Pittsburgh, and Cleveland, and the Florida Keys, and all of the different places that I’ve lived and basically just be able to play over the internet, which is super cool. And so I’ve been flexing my creative muscles by writing kind of and then there were non-style murder mystery, and I’ve been enjoying it so much. And that’s been a lot of my time that isn’t on Zoom calls with people or doing work stuff.

Oge Chigbo:
You guys, Ian also almost come into play Dungeons & Dragons once, never happened, so it’s not my portion, I’m convinced. All right, so great. So what’s next for you?

Ian Buchta:
So I just, yesterday, accepted a job with a local public health agency here in Salt Lake City, where I moved to following graduation and I will be continuing to podcast. So if you guys out there miss my voice after this episode, you can find me on Making it Through, a Podcast About Hope, which it’s just a podcast where I talk to a lot of people and this is why I was thinking about my answer to the, what’s one thing that you thought you knew, but later realized you wrong about, that’s why I’ve been seeing so much hope in people, because we’ve just been talking about that.

Ian Buchta:
And I think right now we all need a little bit of hope, and not just like, “Oh, this is a bit of good news and it makes me feel good for five minutes.” And that’s good, and I respect people who that works for. For me, I’m a pessimist, that doesn’t work. I need reasons that I have reasons to hope. And so I talk to people from, there are quite a few public health people, because my cohost is Juan Gudino, who’s from The University of Iowa who just graduated in epidemiology with me. And so we do talk public health, but I talk to people from all walks of life if you need else as well. So if you give our project a listen, we would be eternally grateful, and you can find us in a link in the description field of this podcast, or you can just search, Making it Through, a Podcast About Hope, just about anywhere you get your pods.

Oge Chigbo:
I will be making, hopefully, some guest appearances on that podcast too. So I will be plugging in, maybe it’s at some point too, we’ll see.

Ian Buchta:
You’re definitely welcome any time.

Oge Chigbo:
All right. Great. Thank you. So is there anything else that you want to say before we go?

Ian Buchta:
I just want to say I’m so, so proud of what we have done as a team, just to see this thing grow from me trying to record a couple people at American Public Health Associations annual conference to a machine of a bunch of really brilliant people around me. The fact that now I can step back and let this brilliant team do work and I get to just watch and see what they create, I am so, so excited. I do want to shout out Hailey Boudreau. I probably should have said her name before this. She was the other reason that this podcast got off the ground. She took a lot of interviews in the beginning, made some of our best pods in the beginning. So really do want to shout her out as well.

Ian Buchta:
And I want to say thank you to the listeners. We’ve been journeying together for a long time, a year and a half that I was producing this podcast, and you all have been listening. And every minute that you all gave us during that time is something that I appreciate so much. Because I know there are so many different things you could listen to, but the fact that you all chose to listen to a podcast that I was working on, a podcast that we all as a team were working on is really meaningful and it means so much to us that we know that we’re getting out the best public health information and making a difference.

Ian Buchta:
So I am so, so grateful to you, the listeners, I’m so grateful to the amazing team that I have worked with, Oge, Emma Meador, Luke Sampson, and Steve Sonnier, just every day has been a gift with you all. This has been a heck of a ride. Thank you to The College of Public Health as well for believing in us and letting us give this a try.

Oge Chigbo:
It’s been an amazing to you, Ian, as our executive producer. But change is always difficult, but I guess, is needed and hopefully we’ll be as amazing or even better from where you left us.

Ian Buchta:
I don’t just facetiously say I’m excited to see what you all create. I’m legitimately excited to see all the interactions.

Oge Chigbo:
I know, which is putting on the pressure, but I guess he’s applying pressure, you guys, so we just have to match up. So we will, we will. All right. So where can people find you?

Ian Buchta:
I just got a Twitter and I share a mix of epi news and good news @buchtaian. I also have some nerdy things too, but mostly at the epi and mostly good news.

Oge Chigbo:
Cool. All right, so that is @buchtaian.

Ian Buchta:
Thank you, Oge. And thank you, Oge. This has been awesome hosting this pod with you. We’ve had a lot of fun together and I hope everyone out there has enjoyed it too.

Oge Chigbo:
I hope so too, you guys. I brought my extra [inaudible 00:24:26] chatty self here. I’m usually very quiet. I’m doing this for you guys. We’re out of here. You can find us on Facebook at The University of Iowa, College of Public Health or on iTunes and Spotify as well at The University of Iowa, College of Public Health.

Ian Buchta:
You can let us know what you thought about this episode at cph-gradambassador@uiowa.edu. That’s cph-gradambassador@uiowa.edu. I’m glad that is the last time I have to spell that out because it is so [inaudible 00:25:08].

Oge Chigbo:
This episode of From the Front Row was hosted by Oge Chigbo and Ian Buchta, and was produced by Ian Buchta.

Ian Buchta:
Don’t forget to leave us a rating and review on Apple podcasts and share us with some people that you know.

Oge Chigbo:
All right, guys. So I will see you next week. Happy social distancing, stay safe, have the uncomfortable conversation, practice self care, and do everything you need to do to make sure that you are living your best healthy life. All right, see you next week.